SPOILER: Survey for those who beat the Opposition Hideout

I also would not have tried to use the speedups. I did try that in stage 1 using the hammer on rocks and it said it was not strong enough and so I didn't think to try it here :( but still since caveman quest won't complete either way not sure it matters. Someone said kill a dog to get meat but that will not be an option for me.I am not willing to slaughter a dog. When I try to attack caveman with my army they just run away. guess I won't be completing that quest :(

Killing any animal to get meat, not just dog is also an option, but it's not mandratory. There will be other ways to get it, but for now - not. There are 5 different ways to get past cavement, plus 1 way to go via puzzle, thus you should have plenty of choices. But there might be bugs that prevent you from completing it.

How did you try to attack them and who ran away?

I took all five of my warriors, five hunters and my hero and my scouts. When I try to attack nothing really happens I guess. It is really that if I try to put my hero flag at cave entrance all of them run down to the lower right near the number 2. I haven't fully given up on it just frustrated I guess :) 

Oh, so you are just trying to put a flag and expect them to fight? Well... the cavement are not agressive in the first place and in order to fight you need to force them to attack you first :)

OK well as I said I haven't fully given up :) should I report lost connection when trying to open the chest?

Why confusing? If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

If it looks like a duck but has a description that says it's a specific type of duck that swims in a specific type of area, maybe people won't realise that the duck can also swim in other ponds as well. 

Good rule of thumb: just because it's obvious to the people who designed it, doesn't make it obvious to everyone else.

That's why I am asking why it's not obvious. The description on those items does not say it's exclusively does what it does and cannot be poked around with. Actaully some people did managed to apply it so it's not only me. I've programmed the ability to use powerups because I thought people would be confused why they have a pickaxe and unable to break the slates with it.

Are you serious? The description does not exclude uses, therefore it should be obvious that you can use it for things other than what it describes?

Er, ok then... remind me next time I buy butter that I should try to use it as sunscreen then, because nowhere on the packaging says that it shouldn't be used that way.

As for the pick axe, I find it more believable and fitting with the rest of the game that there might be an item, like a jackhammer that can only be used once you reach a certain technological age. I think it's utterly confusing that you have equip-able items, power-ups, and then items that do both. You don't have to have an item that 'perfectly fits', but the way the items are described and the way you are introduced to using them, doesn't make it at all obvious that some do both. It's not even obvious how you combine items or later deconstruct them (yes, allowing for interface changes later I'm aware that might not be implemented at this stage).

Overall I don't understand why you find the ability to break rocks with pickaxe confusing and prohibition to break it - not :) And I am trying hard to figure out :)

It's not that I find using a pickaxe to break rocks confusing. It's that I had assumed the image of the pickaxe was related to the description of being able to increase stone resources. That makes perfect sense as a way to visualise what the power-up does. A simple icon that quickly conveys the power-up usage of the item.

The simple fact that you label it and describe it as a power-up item is the confusing part.

Take the blueprint for example. The blueprint is an easy icon that says "use me on upgrading buildings". If you told me I could also use it for a private message chat, I'd believe you but still be just as confused. Don't forget that the expectations of how to use something is also taught through the game system. If you program the game to repeatedly tell us "use blueprint to upgrade this building", we'd have no knowledge or expectation that it could do anything else.

Anyway, look it's no matter now. I am now aware that I can try more stuff than before. I am mostly annoyed because I scratched my head for days and tried every (obvious) item that I could think of before giving up.

My basic comment still stands: it's probably too obscure and that's why you surveyed us, to find out if it was.

Couple of people is not a survey yet, but I got your idea.

I will be the 3rd annoyed person because there is a direct explanation of an item under it: "increases stone production in your town" and nothing that it can be used as an adventure tool - it's not even there. it's way too obscure. There should be 2 different tools, or a sing that it also may be used as an adventure tool. You don't need to write where exactly it can be used - just a slight hint for a player, like "guess what? i can do different tasks also - just try me"

I am annoyed also because I already tried to use pickaxe in my town to remove stone and hard piles - it didn't work. then why should it work in a different location? - I think that's the main question that all stuck players think about and don't use it.

OK, I managed to get into the cave after braking the rocks. But when my hero came to the second entrance inside the cave, it stopped and didn't react to anything. I had to remove the flag, the hero disappeared, I put a flag again. And from the 2nd try I finally was able to lead my hero past this place deeper inside and found Gromus.

BWT, there were minor misspellings in the conversation, I submitted them to a misspelling thread.

For example there are 6 ways to get inside the cave. One via puzzle and others are via cavemen entrace:

I see it was hard for some people so probably we will give another piece of meat somewhere on location to simplify things up.

One more idea: I tired to give the last caveman fish but apparently he doesn't like sushi. But it still may become another option - let him 1 fish, he refuses as it is not the same as meet, and agrees only on, say, 10 fish - this is not as simple as finding 1 more piece of meet in the location. 

As for poweups - now we already know that we can use them, but to avoid future players' frustration it is a good idea to mention it in the tutorial. Or as you said place quest items in quest locations.

P.S. I still couldn't find a chisel. Is it a random item or quest item in a specific place? I try to find out whether I'm not that lucky to get it as a random stuff, or I didn't pay enough attention searching all around?

P.P.S. I finished with Opposition Hideout and now eager to play future quest locations mentioned by Gromus!!!

I knew I should have stopped reading this! I purposely researched the cavemen in one of me hero's to see what would happen if I took him with me and before I built the building I read this post and find out that is one answer :( I wish I had more self control when it comes to new posts :)

Why confusing? If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

If it looks like a duck but has a description that says it's a specific type of duck that swims in a specific type of area, maybe people won't realise that the duck can also swim in other ponds as well. 

Good rule of thumb: just because it's obvious to the people who designed it, doesn't make it obvious to everyone else.

That's why I am asking why it's not obvious. The description on those items does not say it's exclusively does what it does and cannot be poked around with. Actaully some people did managed to apply it so it's not only me. I've programmed the ability to use powerups because I thought people would be confused why they have a pickaxe and unable to break the slates with it.

In cases where items look like they could work but do not work due to game design decision I try to come up with believable explanation. For example you need a knife or sword (which are usually equipable items and not quest items) to cut wild cabbage, but people might try to use stone scythe as well. I've programmed that wild cabbage is shred to pieces and message pops up that you need more delicate tool.

I think it will be more confusing when people will have an item that perfectly fits to solve their situation, but unable to use it because it's powerup. At least in such cases they still need explanation why they cannot use it. Not all people will understand the "specialness" behind powerups at all.

Overall I don't understand why you find the ability to break rocks with pickaxe confusing and prohibition to break it - not :) And I am trying hard to figure out :)

And yet when we try to use the sickle thing to cut down reeds that are in the way it does not work. When we try to use the saw to remove trees that are in the way, it does not work. When we try to use one of these hammers to remove the rock blocking the chest, it does not work. Like someone said earlier, just because it is obvious to you, does not mean it will be obvious to those of us who did not program the game.

1.well, first I tried to give the cavemen some meat, but at last 1 caveman left without any meat to feed him, I thought I can't get past him so I tried to find another way, my fishing pole wasn't ready and couldn't find the floater, (it was a very bad place behind those bushes!! because I didn't know what shape it has that I should find!) I thought the statue puzzle was separately something else, but when I solved it I got to the cave, after exploring the whole cave I understood that I can get out of the cave from the door that 1 caveman stood, and I understood that fishing for that man was very useless! because he didn't help at all!

2.the puzzle was a bit hard on the first impression, but with more time and concentration I could find it's logic, but I guess in general it was a sudden increase than the puzzle before in the tutorial, I think it's better to be the 4th or 5th puzzle

3. I explained this section in previous ones, I heard it has 6 ways to get into the cave, that surprises me! because I just found 3 ones!

4.it's smaller, I died once, while fighting those dendrogs but I didn't expect to die so early in the game, as I thought I was well prepared! I'm glad that here we don't need to find those small gems! they were nightmare! I think since it it's the alpha version we shouldn't expect much, but in comparison with the ttgold, it had more puzzles to solve in one map

Just a note: I didn't realize I could get into the hideout until several days into the game because I could see the hideout across the water.  I thought I had to build a boat to get there.  LOL.  

1. How did you get into the cave? (There are several ways)

I went in the game via the "backdoor" by solving the puzzle.  I'm guessing I could have bribed the other cavemen with meat and could have entered that way too...but I was only able to find one piece of meat.

2. How difficult was the puzzle? I could have made it easier but since it is not obligatory to progress I decided to leave it as is and get some feedback.

At first I wasn't sure how to solve it.  I was a bit frustrated but then after I completed the wade, I realized that I had to activate the puzzle first before I could actually solve it.  After the puzzle was activated, I spent about 5 to 10 minutes trying to figure out what I was supposed to do, but I managed to figure it out.  

3. Also post here what you did to solve quests in this location - it will be interesting to see how different people did it as there are various ways.

To build the wade, I lost 1200 stones the first time around because I did not know that there was a limit on my campsite.  However, what I did the second time around is that I timed my deliveries of 400 stones so that two would arrive one after the other.  

For the caveman who is looking for fish - I had already had some fish I had fished for at my hometown so that was very quick.

Those are the only two I have done so far.

4. Finally I would like to know how this location compares to the quest locations from original Totem Tribe in terms of size and content quality.

I thought it was very comparable and had a similar look and feel to TT1.

I went in after solving puzzle. Started pressing idols and numbers and thinking maybe it was similar to fire puzzle on

Beetle Island in TTG.  Anyway, got into cave.  I've fed 4 cavemen, caught fish and found everything I could to this point.

Wade was a little harder and it was only by chance (after learning I killed my dogs while visiting place with no food) that I sent stone and found I needed to fill in wade. I think you need more of a hint there to help get everything started.

Had to go back 3 times to kill all the dondrogs(?)  1 with troops and 2 times alone.  Have gained lots of experience at using altar.

I enjoyed it but a few tweaks will certainly help.  Can't wait for the quests at the next three locations !

1. If your strength is high enough (10 at the moment, will be 5 after update), you can call them out to fight.
2. If your strength is even higher (20 at the moment, will be 10), you can intimidate them without even fighting.

When will this update be?

I also found it weird that hints for the different uses of the power ups are not mentioned in their description, it could have at least something like 'Can also be used on some objects'.

Also, about the quest. I had to visit forums to find out that i had to use stone on the wade, the description that we get after using stone would fit better when clicking first time on the wade.

About the cavemen, it's really confusing only having 3 pieces of meat when 4 needed, somebody could spend hours trying to find on the map the last piece of meat thinking that there is one. Like a noob i put every stat point on strength (strength is always the best on RPGs :D), having the option to just kill them by having 5 strength is nice.

About the statue puzzle, it is not hard to solve once you click 3 and 4 few times. Also, maybe not all players will explore the whole map, there could be a very small hint that 1 & 2 are needed.

The monsters were easy, it's obvious a small army is needed, can't understand how people died from them ._.

To build the wade, I lost 1200 stones the first time around because I did not know that there was a limit on my campsite.  However, what I did the second time around is that I timed my deliveries of 400 stones so that two would arrive one after the other.  

I upgraded my campsite to deliver 600-800 stones simultaneously. Actually, the first 200 of lost stones made me think that I can upgrade structures. And, yes, if you click on a campsite, you'll see that it's level 1, and there is an "upgrade" button. So I just used some of the stones for a quick upgrade and it saved me a lot of of time on delivering rocks.

The monsters were easy, it's obvious a small army is needed, can't understand how people died from them ._.

Well! I thought that too! and I chose leaderism(or leadership) with the army of two dogs, 3 hunters and I guess 2 braves, but when I tried to fight those dendrogs(I'm not sure about spelling!) the battle just froze and after perhaps 30 seconds I saw all my troops including my hero dead! but they could kill only 2 of 4!! perhaps that was a bug!